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Talk:Tallon IV
Discussion Were the Chozo still on Tallon IV when the Pirates came to it? Because some of the scans telling you where to find the artifacts said that Pirates or 'invaders' had set up a base in Phrendrana. But also the pirates scans seem to contradict this. Anyone know anything about this? Hellkaiserryo12 20:34, 1 February 2009 (UTC) Chozo Ghosts? Some space pirate scans do mention them. Not all of them were insane yet as some help samus at the end of the fight with ridley. Metroidhunter32 22:09, 1 February 2009 (UTC) Tallon I, II, and III? I've been wondering, where are Tallon I, II, and III? Let me explain first why a planet would have numerals. 1. The planet is one of multiple planets which orbit around the same sun. The sun is the original name bearer and the planets are denoted numerals. 2. The planet is one of several moons which orbit the same planet. The Planet is the original name bearer and the moons are all given numbers. 3. The planet is one of several with the same name, because it's discoverers felt ties or similarities with another planet of another system. It looks to me that 3 is the answer, because we can obviously see in the solar system hologram in the Pirate base in Metroid Prime that the sun's name there is not Tallon, there are no other planets named Tallon in the system, and Tallon IV is not a moon. So my guess is that Tallon I, II, and III are also Chozo inhabited planets, because they were its discoverers. User:Tuckerscreator 14:40 25 April 2009 : I always dissmissed thoughts like this because i thought "Tallon 4" was a reference to the four "tallons" of a Metroid. Hellkaiserryo12 22:09, 25 April 2009 (UTC) Heh, that's funny. Napoleon Dynamite: Do the Metroids have large Tallons? This same numeral problem also comes up with Phrysig, a moon of Bes III and the homeworld of the Phrysigians(such as Rundas). The planet should actually be called Bes and the moon Bes III. They have it backwards. It's bad science in Metroid. This is why gamers fail their exams. User:Tuckerscreator 16:23 25 April 2009 : I think I've heard the Metroid one before, and it makes the most sense. Ought to be in the page's trivia as speculation. Where are we getting this moon name system from? Star Wars? Anyway, TIV doesn't have moons. I think GF would likely name things in a way different then we do. Maybe they name them the same way we name hurricanes or something, or the discoverer names them. Maybe the planet was named by the Chozo? ChozoBoy http://metroid.wikia.com ADMIN (Talk/ ) 00:15, 26 April 2009 (UTC) This is the same planet naming system that NASA uses. You assign planetary bodies numerals based on the name of the star it orbits or the planet the moons orbit. Our own solar system does not follow this rule, because those moons' and planets' names were in place long before modern astronomy. I can't see any reason for why the Chozo would name Tallon IV in regard to Metroids, but it's a safe bet to say that the Chozo discovered the planet. My guess is that the Chozo have other planets they colonized that are Tallons I, II, and III, and they named this one IV in reverent regard to the others. User:Tuckerscreator 20:58 25 April 2009 Kind of not really a dead horse, at least an old, feeble one, but this is from the official site back when it was up: "A Wanderer-Class planet, Tallon IV is one of two worlds within the Tallon system capable of sustaining life." So, in response to the original post it is indeed the first option of the planet's sun (FS-176) is named "Tallon" and this is the fourth planet in orbit around it. --''Madax the Shadow'' {ADMIN} (talk • • ) 03:49, September 6, 2016 (UTC) I thought the IV came from the fact that this was the fourth Metroid game released. Although Metroid Fusion also shares this distinction, these two adventures were released at (around?) the same time...right? DarkraiShadowXZ (talk) 01:23, August 8, 2019 (UTC) They were released on the same day. [[User:RoyboyX|'R'o'y'b'o'y'X']](complaints/ ) 03:56, August 8, 2019 (UTC) Years? Where are these figures of "two years prior" and such coming from? The pirate scans never mentioned years to my knowledge--only Cycles, and it's never been confirmed exactly what a cycle is. Dazuro 04:34, 26 April 2009 (UTC) I thought the same thing. You're welcome to look into it. If I recall correctly, that was added pretty recently, and you could find the editor and ask them and/or Ctrl+F through the game's scans. ChozoBoy http://metroid.wikia.com ADMIN (Talk/ ) 16:24, 26 April 2009 (UTC) The two years figure is found in the first lore you encounter on the Pirate Homeworld, nearby that turret next to the elevator. I'll go back and see if it says cycles rather than years. I figure, that by cycles, they mean they same things as years, but, even though I was the one that first noticied this discrepancy between Pirate years and Federation years, I wasn't the one to put up on the Tallon IV article. Someone else must have put it up after seeing my comments on a forum User:Tuckerscreator 13:22 26 April 2009 Cycles definitely are not the same thing as years. ... Interesting. It says "two stellar years" in that log. However, that still leaves some ambiguity--every planet has its own 'year'length, obviously, and we have no way of knowing which area's year--if any--is the base for a Stellar Year. Dazuro 21:12, 26 April 2009 (UTC) Yeah, a stellar year may not be the same thing as a planetary year but I reason why I feel the Pirates sytem is closer to ours than the Federations is because they put the arrival of the Leviathan at Tallon IV at about 20 years, which is reasonable, versus the Federation's record of 50 years. By the Federation's record, Samus would have been nearly 50 years old in Metroid Prime, becuase the Chozo there remembered her as a child. It may be a mistake on the part of Retro or something else we don't know about but this is a major plot hole. Oh, and thanks for clearing up that problem on the trivia section; I don't know who put up after I talked about this 'cause I didn't. User:Tuckerscreator 14:35 26 April 2009 Wait, what? The Chozo on Tallon IV never knew her. She was raised by the Zebesian Chozo. The Tallon Chozo merely prophecied her. And the Pirates, to my recollection, only estimated the time of the meteor's impact. On top of that, Pirates use second-hand, stolen, poor quality equipment very often, while the Federation's are likely to be more up-to-date and accurate. Adding to that the fact that the Federation's count was in a more recent game, there's always the argument that it's a retcon. Either way, there's a contradiction, but I'm pretty sure 50 years is the "canon" amount. Dazuro 21:40, 26 April 2009 (UTC) This is somewhat unrelated, but the PAL version of Metroid Prime, the Chozo Lore is a bit more ambiguous on whether the one they see in their visions is actually Samus and it takes out anything directly mention of her Chozo origins, though it still talks about it indirectly. It would've been nice if they had done that for the NTSC version, too. This would've cleared the discrepancies a little bit. DesertLynx83 06:33, 6 July 2009 (UTC) Discrepancy Let me quote a bit from the Chozo lore in Metroid Prime. It speaks of these Chozo on Tallon IV having known Samus personally. : Do our eyes look backward, seeing the Hatchling as she once was? We see her wounded eyes, and remember the child we found so long ago....Clad in Chozo armor, wielding weapons our hands once held?...Was she this way before? When we Chozo found her, a fledging orphaned on a savaged planet, did a warrior's pulse already beat in her veins? These Chozo speaking here sound like they once lived on Zebes, and were there when Samus was adopted after the raid on K-2L. Since they arrived on Tallon IV before the Leviathan arrived, these individuals must have left Zebes soon after she was adopted. They settled, became spirits, the Leviathan came and you know the rest. The Space Pirates arrive and they estimate the Leviathan's arrival to be about 20 years ago. This would then logically follow that Samus is roughly a little more than 20 years old. But if we say that the Pirate estimating system is wrong and go by the GF estimation, then it would logically follow that Samus is roughly 50 years old! But she looks too young to be 50 so it must be a mistake or a difference in the calendar. One could try to follow a moderate view, which states both dates are correct: The Leviathan arrived 20 years early at the time of Metroid Prime, then Corruption occurred 30 years later. The problem with this is, not only does this still not solve Samus's age problem, but you run into another conflict with the calendars. The Pirate calendar has the discovery of Phazon, meaning the events of Metroid Prime, occuring 2 years/cycles ago, not 30. So this must mean that there has to be a difference in the calendars, and the Pirate system appears to be the correct one. User:Tuckerscreator 15:04 26 April 2009 :What the heck does MP have to do with anything? No one said the events of the game took place 30 years ago. The pirates said that they discovered Phazon 2 years ago, and estimated that the meteor landed 18 years prior to that. They said they discovered it 2 years ago--''not'' that it appeared 2 years ago. As for the Chozo. They lived on Tallon IV among the phazon for some time, did they not? Hence how some of them became corrupted, and turned. It's possible that some of the Zebesian chozo came to Tallon IV after the impact, or something like that. Beyond that, again, we do not know what a Stellar Year is. It might be vastly different from the Earth years we age Samus by. For all we know, the meteor crashed a few weeks ago. Dazuro 22:26, 26 April 2009 (UTC) You misunderstood me, Dazuro. The Pirate mention of the discovery of Phazon is in MP3 Corruption, meaning we can not suggest that both calendars are correct, becuse we can not reconcile a date of 30 years and 2 years without changing the calendar for at least one party. So there must be either be a mistake or the Pirate calendar is closer to our own, while the GF's is not, odd as it sounds, because it should be the opposite.User:Tuckerscreator 15:32 26 April 2009 :I'' misunderstood? 30 years and 2 years are referring to entirely different things, as I said. The meteor impacted 20/30/50 years ago. The pirates discovered phazon 2 years ago. That's all. Dazuro 22:33, 26 April 2009 (UTC) No, what I said that the moderate view would have the discovery of Phazon being at 2/30 years and the arrival of the Leviathan at 20/50 years. But what it should actually be is the arrival of the Leviathan being at 20/50 years and the discovery of Phazon at 2/?? years, because we can see the moderate view forces us to accept both systems as standard solar years, when we can see from the above that the GF calendar must be the different one and the Pirates' the closest to ours. User:Tuckerscreator 15:47 26 april 2009 :What the hell are you trying to say? Phazon was discovered years after the meteor impact. The dates (2 years and 20/50 years) are completely separate. The only issue here is whether it's 20 or 50 years, or possibly both in different calendars. Dazuro 22:52, 26 April 2009 (UTC) Exactly. Now you see my point, Dazuro. My main reason for pointing the 2 years/30 years discrepancy was to cement the fact that one can not asume that the Sapce Pirate and the GF have the same calendar and that the Pirate calendar is the closer to ours. So now you see my point User:Tuckerscreator 18:22 26 April 2009 :Erm... actually, I don't see your point at all. My entire point is that there IS no 2 years/30 years discrepency... Dazuro 01:24, 27 April 2009 (UTC) Since Samus looks like she's in her mid to late 20s or possibly early 30s, there's no way she could be that old. My guess is it's an error or, like mentioned before, different calendars. The whole thing could've been resolved if we knew exactly how their stupid calendar worked since it doesn't seem to be the same as ours in any case. DesertLynx83 01:55, 6 July 2009 (UTC) :Nintendo doesn't want doesn't want to reveal how their calendar works, since some especcially savvy number guy might figure what year this is all taking place and then that year turns out to be not like in the game. so they have to hide it with things like "the year 20X5." But if the GF calendar really is this messed up, that makes me wonder about shorter dates like "a month" or "seven days ago." How can we trust them anymore?--[[User:Tuckerscreator|'Tuckerscreator']] 02:19, 6 July 2009 (UTC) ::Well, the Federation's messed up anyway, so what do you expect? It might've just been a mistake and we're looking too much into it. Nintendo may not even really know how the calendar works for all we know. Also, to be fair, Metroid Prime isn't the only series with continuity errors. Other series games have them, too. Regardless, we'll probably never know the truth. Sucks, but such is life. DesertLynx83 03:45, 6 July 2009 (UTC) Perhaps samus ages slower becuase of her Chozo blood? |Oceania| This argument is kinda painful to read, to clear things up Dazuro... When Tucker refers to a 2year/30year discrepancy, he is not talking about an in-game discrepancy, he is disproving his own theory, read the comments more carefully so this doesn't become a flame war... Zuken 01:04, September 24, 2009 (UTC) You know, I've got to tell you all that the PAL version of Metroid Prime has been the canon version the moment Metroid Prime Trilogy was released, and most likely before, too. All three games are the PAL versions, and whatever makes it in an ultimate culmination of a beloved game trilogy is always assumed to be canon in the series. This would mean that, since the Tallon IV Chozo didn't specifically mention Samus past her saving Tallon IV, the Chozo in Metroid Prime haven't met her, nor did they take care of her. Werty yertrew 01:49, September 24, 2009 (UTC) Also it seems extremely unlikely that the chozo would colonize a planet, build an entire new culture (one without tech), ascend to the point of prophecy and leaving the physical realm, , come back to the physical world, research and fight against the phazon, build new shrines to help samus, build the cipher and cradle, leave the physical realm again, then more time passes, then the pirates arrive and then samus does... and this is all supposed to occur within 20 years? It seems more like the events of a century or so... Zuken 16:59, September 25, 2009 (UTC) Naming Tallon IV is quite similar to Talos IV, a planet in the Star Trek series. The Menagerie, one of the episodes it appeared in, was a very popular episode of TOS (as far as I know). The planets themselves have very little in common, however. 03:15, 25 May 2009 (UTC) Aspect Tallon IV, when looked at from space, looks as if its been burned, because all you can see are deserts. However, it has its rainforest area and it snowy area. Weird... That's probably due to Phazon destroying thandscape. But remember, the area of Tallon IV Samus visited was only a small part of the planet, not the whole thing. The part she was on was probably no bigger than a single city.--Tuckerscreator 23:20, 28 June 2009 (UTC) :Mmmm, maybe. I think it was the Phazon. Or there is dust in the atmosphere? |Oceania| I just fixed a few errors, such as 2.500 is now changed to 2,500 -- 17:48, September 19, 2009 (UTC) I don't think that is relevant.... Anyways, I agree with the "Dust in the atmosphere" concept. The Phazon just can't do such a drastic change. Werty yertrew 01:58, September 24, 2009 (UTC) Discrepency Reexamined The glaring inconsistencies found in Metroid Prime (NTSC) is the reason why there is a problem with the 50 year issue with Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. With the purchase of Metroid Prime Trilogy, it comes with a small folded "brochure" called "Metroid Prime Trilogy History." In this "brochure," it even mentions that the Phazon meteor struck Tallon IV 50 years ago. It says also that the time Tallon IV was struck, so had planet Aether been struck. Both planets suffered for 50 years before Samus arrived. You might notice that in the Chozo Lore in the PAL version (Chozo Lore), there is no mention of Samus Aran like there was in the NTSC version. There is only the mention of a woman. The Chozo on Tallon IV never knew Samus, nor did they ever meet Samus. They understand that not all prophecies came to pass, but if the promise of a savior was to come, they would leave behind their technology. The one who finds the 12 Artifacts would be the "Entrusted One." Now, this is not just the only issue. Many fans realized that there were inconsistencies in the NTSC version of Prime. Even the Pirate Data called Phazon Analysis was changed. Consider the following: "We have codified the newfound energy source as Phazon, a V-index mutagen of which we have very little reliable data. Indications point to a meteor of unknown origin impacting approximately 20 years ago, expelling Phazon into the environment." (NTSC Version) "We have codified the newfound energy source as Phazon, a V-index mutagen of which we have very little reliable data. Indications point to a meteor of unknown origins impacting an indeterminable time ago, expelling Phazon into the environment." (PAL Version) It seems clear to me that the PAL version, because it was re-released in the Metroid Prime Trilogy, that the PAL version is the official data. Anything from the NTSC that does not contradict the PAL version may be permitted as well. So, because of this, I think it is best now that we remove the Contradicting Impact Dates, or at least revise it. I am of the opinion that we should just revise it and note the differences between the PAL version and the NTSC version. Metroid Fan 22:44, July 28, 2010 (UTC) That would make sense. Also, everyone seems to attribute the fact that while the Chozo might have found Samus 50 years ago, she looks about 20 to relativistic time dialation. I think it's more likely that her Chozo enhancements included some form of increased longevity. That is, of course, if the 50 year date is correct, and not the 20 year one...--AdmiralSakai 00:02, July 29, 2010 (UTC) Well, that idea isn't really necessary when it comes down to the Phazon meteor striking Tallon IV. The meteor most likely struck Tallon IV long before Samus was born, and this does not conflict with what the PAL version tells us. You may check this timeline http://metroid-database.com/features/timeline.php. I take this timeline with a grain of salt. Let's consider this timeline. *The Levianthan strikes Tallon IV in the year 2,026. *Samus is born in the year 2,055. Right now that is 29 years. We're close to 50 years, but not quite. *Samus is born in the year 2,055. *Samus' mission on Tallon IV starts in the year 2,076. That is 21 years. So, Samus would be 21 according to this timeline. 29 + 21 = 50. This works perfectly, although the Metroid Prime Trilogy History says, again, that the mission on Tallon IV took place three years after Samus' Zero Mission. So it would add three years. Either way, both do not conflict with what the Chozo Lore or Pirate Data says. Therefore, no assumptions about Samus being 50 years old, but appearing no younger than in her twenties is necessary. By the way, even people in their fifties can look like they are in their twenties without any Chozo DNA integrated into them. Yes, I am talking about real people. :p Metroid Fan 01:25, July 29, 2010 (UTC) Everything you mention is very probably the way it actually works. However, if it does turn out that the NOA lore that mentions Samus specifically is correct (i.e. if we see something similar in another game) then I would like to see all theories given weight in the article based on their plausibility. Since Chozo enhancement is a fairly plausible explanation, given that the Chozo themselves are stated as being extremely long-lived, I simply found its absence in the article before we resolved the discrepancy to be somewhat odd.--AdmiralSakai 02:39, July 29, 2010 (UTC) You will have to forgive me for that. It really wouldn't make any sense, however, for Samus to be fifty years old. Samus loses her parents at the age of three. She leaves planet Zebes at the age of fourteen. She returns to planet Zebes later on in her life, but there is no way the idea of a 50 year old Samus would work within such a short time frame. When all the evidence favors for something more plausible that works against other speculations, it is, I believe, the preferred choice. Metroid Fan 03:21, July 29, 2010 (UTC) Of course. As I said, it only seemed odd when we were seriously considering that timeframe.--AdmiralSakai 13:10, July 29, 2010 (UTC) Mass of Tallon IV :''Mass: 5.1 trillion teratons What is meant here: *5.1x1012x1012 tons (=5.1x1024 tonnes) *5.1x1018x1012 tons (=5.1x1030 tonnes)? **'For comparison: Earth:' about 6x1012x1012 tonnes (=6x1024 tons) I think it's the first (from memory) - is there any proof? Do you think we should use the scientific notation too to prevent misunderstandings? ())¯_¯_¯_¯_>2 (Talk) 16:44, July 10, 2012 (UTC) Mass Typo? Generally people insist that "5.1 trillion teratons" is a typo, despite it being consistent between every version of the game as well as the website. The suggestedly correct unit would be gigatons. I don't refute that argument, but I don't like it, and many parts of this set of info leave me feeling uneasy. To start, the notation used is utterly bizzare. It starts with a sig fig: makes sense. Then it puts "trillion" spelled out instead of using scientific notation; that's confusing. The ensemble is topped off with a unit that doesn't actually measure mass; I did a little research and in real life, both teratons and gigatons describe the yeild of a nuclear explosion compared to the mass of tnt required to accomplish the same yield. There is the typo explanation or the density explanation. These are the simplest and, perhaps, the most likely. I conjured up two extremely improbable explanations that I think are still worth some consideration given the peculiarities noted above; teraton could be a totally different unit of mass that the Space Pirates use; teraton could describe mass based on the yield it would have if broken apart into it's energy components. I would really like to hear more alternative explanations because the density theory has serious holes and the typo theory really doesn't sit right with me.